Soft Parts Best Practices

[Stroker]

2 hours ago, Blackwatch said:

Do the 8-9" or so measurements for the bund work for troopers  with a gut?  Im not skinny, so when  I tried to make a bund before,  mine came up in my chest and back, trying to keep it from popping out especially in back when I bend over. 

 

Yes it should. You get any more taller on the bund it affects how the the armor sets. In short it throws the whole costume off. 

[Blackwatch]

Ok. I dont have armor, so Ill need to get armor before I can do this, but Ill make a practice set out of all the natural heavy cotton cavnas I have laying around here. 

[BikerScout007]

20 hours ago, Blackwatch said:

Do the 8-9" or so measurements for the bund work for troopers  with a gut?  Im not skinny, so when  I tried to make a bund before,  mine came up in my chest and back, trying to keep it from popping out especially in back when I bend over. 

 

The belt should tuck under the chest armor, but it should rest on top of the belt -- not necessarily go under it.  It may affect the height depending on the size of your midsection, but not by too much.  I'd experiment with some fabric first.   The bund pretty much fits in the gap from the bottom of your pectorals down to your belly button.

[Aradun]

Ok. I dont have armor, so Ill need to get armor before I can do this, but Ill make a practice set out of all the natural heavy cotton cavnas I have laying around here. 

You can certainly wait until you have your armor on hand as that would be the ideal, but as the cummerbund is now a set height of 8-9” you can pretty much make it without armor. The overall length is what will vary from scout to scout, as how much material is needed to wrap around one’s midsection will vary.

Using your old canvas material to make a mock up is a great idea which will allow you to fine tune your measurements for a perfect fit.


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[Toothdoc]

So for you veteran scouts that have plenty of deployment trooping hours, do you find the cummerbund is somewhat flimsy and tends to scrunch up vertically at all?  What I mean is, if you use your pouches to put your wallet, cell phone, cards, keys, etc. in, do you find that the weight of those items want to collapse your bund somewhat.

I’m about to start constructing my cummerbund and thought that maybe a double layer of canvas (duck cloth) might help give it some needed support and help keep its shape better.  I envision putting a 9” width double layer of duck cloth, then a double layer of thin poly batting and then the outer polished cotton on the outside and sew it all up like that.  Would give some substance to those who choose to attach their canvas pouches with Velcro. I realize that some guys attach Velcro to the back of the bund to stick to their flak vest or flight suit for an option...

Overkill or reasonable design?

[Chopper]

I have never had this issue, but my bund is attached with velcro to my vest. Like many of us, I did some overbuilding myself when i was putting my scout together, but I've never found that I needed anything more than some velcro at the top of my bund to keep it in position -- even with a cell phone, keys, and wallet in the pouches. Keep it simple!

[Toothdoc]

On 12/13/2019 at 2:01 PM, Chopper said:

KriptonTop on Etsy. Just make sure you use Fedex shipping. 

Here's my setup with his flak vest and cod.

Corey, might you be willing to post some pictures of your cod piece with a ruler in several areas so we might get a better idea on how to reproduce it?  Also, how long is your flak vest?  I assume it comes down to about your navel?

[Chopper]

6 hours ago, Toothdoc said:

Corey, might you be willing to post some pictures of your cod piece with a ruler in several areas so we might get a better idea on how to reproduce it?  Also, how long is your flak vest?  I assume it comes down to about your navel?

Yeah, I'd say that the bottom of the vest is a bit above my navel.

Here's a photo of my set up with some measurements for scale. Keep in mind that both my vest and cod are sized for me, so your mileage may vary, depending on your build.

 

[Aradun]

Like Corey, I haven’t had any issues. The top of my bund is attached with Velcro to my flak vest so there’s no sagging. To help the pouches keep their shape I created rectangular box inserts that rise about 1.5”. Keeps the bottom from sagging and keeps the bottom corners nice and crisp.

[TB2190]

On 1/14/2019 at 2:34 AM, BikerScout007 said:

 This is a post I've been meaning to write for a long time, but with Imperial Boots releasing their Scout soft parts, it seems like now is a good time.  I hope this can work as a guide for anyone making Scout soft parts.

I've always believed that this costume really rises or falls based on the quality of the soft goods used.  The armor pieces have to look the part as well, but the Scout really is a soft costume when it comes down to it.   Don't believe me?   Let us quote the creator himself, Mr. Nilo Rodis-Jamero:

"If you look at the outfit, it's mostly cloth.  It appears to be hard, but it's not."

So you can make your armor as perfect as possible, but if the soft goods look bad, it brings the entire thing down.

The key to it is proportion.  If you can get the torso proportions correct, you've gone most of the way toward screen accuracy.   To my eye, if you divide your torso into thirds, and make sure the main pieces fit within those portions, you'll have a great looking Scout.   Check out this picture:

Top third

The chest armor.  Ideally, the chest armor should stop at the bottom of your pectorals.  In the past, some of the chest armors were too large (think KS or old SC), so that made this tough without some modifications, usually by removing some shoulder strap.  But at the end of the day, this thing should fit more like a bra than a chest plate.

I don't have much to say about the vest, because so much of it is hidden by the armor.  Make sure the sleeves don't get bunched up by the shoulder bell straps --- loose shoulder bell straps are key.  The zipties are what should support the bells, not the straps.  Those are just to stabilize the bell.

Middle third

Cummerbund, pouches and belt.   Do I need to say this?  The cummerbund is a cummerbund, not a tube top.  It should not wrap the entire Scout's torso like a tortilla.  By our estimates at looking at all available photos, the cummerbund is between 8 and 9 inches tall.  It was made from a polished white cotton in the film.  It ends at the belt, and the bottom of the pouches line up with the bottom of the bund.

Here are some more photos, since folks seem to have a hard time believing how short the bund actually is.

And from the rear.

So now that we have that clear, can I never see a cummerbund constructed like this again?

This is what your cummerbund should look like:

The pouches (6x5x2) were made of canvas and fit in the gap between the bottom of the chest armor and the top of the belt.  In the film they have a tendency to hang over the belt, but this is caused by the belt riding up on the Scout. 

We say as a rule of thumb that the pouches should start 1 inch from the outermost rib on the bund, but really, if you look at the movie, the outer edge of the pouch lines up with the outer edge of the chest armor.

The belt should be worn on the Scout's waist, which is the narrowest portion of your torso between your ribs and your hips, right around the belly button area.   Think about where you grandfather wears his pants and this should give you a good idea.   The Scout above is also a good demonstration of where the belt should be.  You can see it has slid up a bit and twisted to the side, probably from multiple takes of him running after Han Solo.  

Bottom third

The codpiece.  The codpiece starts out wide and tapers as it reaches the groin area.  Very little of it actually goes between the Scout's legs and it does not pull tightly against the Scout's body.  It was made of polished white cotton.  A fabric stabilizer such as buckram should be put inside of it (along with some batting for depth) in order to keep it from crumpling.   The strap should also be long enough that it doesn't pull tightly against the groin area.

I have seen a glut of codpieces that come straight down on the sides.  I've seen no evidence of this in the films.  They all seem to start wide and taper down in a tongue-like shape.

In the film, the codpiece was sewn to the bottom of the vest.  A lot of Scouts like to attach it to the back of the cummerbund or onto the flight suit.  All of these are fine, but I do not advise sewing it to the bottom of the cummerbund.  That's going to give you the wrong look unless you get all your proportions perfect, and even then, it will make it hard to move around.   What we are are trying to avoid is the codpiece looking like a pantie or a jock strap!

Finally the curved detail.  It's not quite a rainbow, and it's not quite a chevron -- it's a blend of both.  Basically you have two straight lines that curve at the top, and then go straight down again.  

The closest thing I can compare it to is a boomerang.  When I made my codpiece, I drew the two sets of lines going up with a ruler, and then I freehanded the curve on my sewing machine.  That gave the best result.

 

So remember the rule of the thirds!  Use this and you will be well on your way to a Lancer class Scout.   I will add to this as necessary.

How wide is the cod piece from the top to the curve and from the curve to the bottom?

[BikerScout007]

17 minutes ago, TB2190 said:

How wide is the cod piece from the top to the curve and from the curve to the bottom?

We don't know the exact size because no one has ever gotten their hands on a screen used kit. 

You can approximate by looking at screen references.  You can see the codpiece runs between the first left and right boxes on the belt:

The cod strap is 2 inches so you can approximate that the bottom of the codpiece is about 2.5 inches.   So creating a taper between the belt and the bottom of the cod is the best way to go.  That's how I designed mine.  

[Harbinger]

Trying to figure out how the soft parts all go on.

 

Flight suit, vest over flight suit - duh. Bund over that... cod velcros to vest on front/back? Velcro on chest armor to hold down to bund?

@Chopper I see you have your flak/cod together on a hanger in your last reply to me. How does the rest go together?

[Chopper]

51 minutes ago, Harbinger said:

Trying to figure out how the soft parts all go on.

 

Flight suit, vest over flight suit - duh. Bund over that... cod velcros to vest on front/back? Velcro on chest armor to hold down to bund?

@Chopper I see you have your flak/cod together on a hanger in your last reply to me. How does the rest go together?

Vest goes over coveralls. Cod attaches to bottom of vest. Cod strap attaches to back of vest. Bund goes over vest and top of cod. Belt attaches to front of cod to keep it from drooping. You can also add some velcro on upper flak vest chest to keep chest armor from slipping backwards, but not everyone needs it.

See also some general tips in the link below. Use whatever you think might work for you: http://forum.501stpathfinders.com/index.php?/topic/18894-some-tips-for-keeping-your-scout-costume-together-while-trooping/

 

[Harbinger]

Thanks. To clarify, you have velcro on the cod/belt backside to keep it in place vertically then?

[Chopper]

34 minutes ago, Harbinger said:

Thanks. To clarify, you have velcro on the cod/belt backside to keep it in place vertically then?

Yes, velcro on the inside of the belt (the two triangle patches). Velcro on the cod front (the white horizontal band on the cod).

[TreeHuggerMatt]

Ohhh thats a neat trick for the belt rear fella..  Im liking that dea a lot!

[Aradun]

That link Chopper provided is the holy grail for trooping. Those tips and tricks keep everything locked nice and tight. Things don’t droop. They don’t shift. Your kit is tight looking from start to finish when trooping. Best of all, they are pretty simple additions to incorporate into your build. I highly recommend it.


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[Harbinger]

I noticed the cod on the CRL has a clip on it. I don't really see mention of it elsewhere though. Yes/no? Did the film suits have them?

[Chopper]

1 minute ago, Harbinger said:

I noticed the cod on the CRL has a clip on it. I don't really see mention of it elsewhere though. Yes/no? Did the film suits have them?

That's a personal rigging preference -- it is not required. Use it if you think it would be helpful when putting your gear on.

We don't have any publicly available photos of what went under the cod or bund, so we don't know if the film suits had them or not.

[TreeHuggerMatt]

Thats good to know was ive been thinking of a pair of straps to help hold the bund in place similar to what the guy in this video uses 

 

from about 25 secs. 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9FIOcYyUdOw

 

think this will be handy to stop shifting with mybuild

[Aradun]

On 3/24/2022 at 2:05 PM, Harbinger said:

I noticed the cod on the CRL has a clip on it. I don't really see mention of it elsewhere though. Yes/no? Did the film suits have them?

Brien, this is just my personal preference, so take it for what it is, but I'm not a fan of using parachute clips to secure the strap to the cummerbund/flak vest.  That clip will most likely sit, under the CB and press into the small of your back.  I just don't feel that it would be comfortable for long because the CB is usually a snug fit.  I know one or two guys who troop with that set up and I don't know if it's an adjustment/dressing issue, but I almost always see that clip slipping out, causing the strap to sag between their legs while trooping.  I secure mine with hook and loop to the back of my flak vest. 

[BikerScout007]

On 3/24/2022 at 11:05 AM, Harbinger said:

I noticed the cod on the CRL has a clip on it. I don't really see mention of it elsewhere though. Yes/no? Did the film suits have them?

The film suits used a regular slider.  I did a parachute clip so that I could remove it easily, without having to lace the cod strap through the slider.

Doesn't dig into my back though.  I don't even realize it's there what with all the other layers I got on.  

And we don't mention it in the CRL because... it can't be seen!  If it can't be seen from the outside, we don't regulate it.  

[kayelbe]

1 minute ago, BikerScout007 said:

The film suits used a regular slider.  I did a parachute clip so that I could remove it easily, without having to lace it through the slider.

Doesn't dig into my back though.  I don't even realize it's there what with all the other layers I got on.  

I came here to say the same thing.  I don’t notice it at all.  Like any method you have to make sure you measure the strap and take into account how tight it has to be. 

[BikerScout007]

Just now, kayelbe said:

I came here to say the same thing.  I don’t notice it at all.  Like any method you have to make sure you measure the strap and take into account how tight it has to be. 

Yes the strap should be really long.  I think the number one reason for cod crunchies is a strap that is too short.  Mine is about 2 feet long and I really think it could be a few inches longer.  The strap should not be pulling tightly across your groin area.  

[TreeHuggerMatt]

1 hour ago, BikerScout007 said:

Yes the strap should be really long.  I think the number one reason for cod crunchies is a strap that is too short.  Mine is about 2 feet long and I really think it could be a few inches longer.  The strap should not be pulling tightly across your groin area.  

Noticed that from the YT CRL walkthrough there was about 6 inches of excess webbing after the clip.   Had no issue jotting that down and will use the same if chef already hasn't. 

Its a great trick.

 

Plan would be to do it short and then just lengthen the strap until the crunching goes away