woobiee Posted March 5, 2022 Share Posted March 5, 2022 I'd love to share my experience with these two often talked about offerings of ready-made biker boots, how they compare to each other, and ultimately how they align with the current CRL. I apologize if this comparison has already been made in the past and if it is the case, I hope this can add to the dataset. Preface I am not endorsed or affiliated by any company or anyone that would give bias to one over the other. This is a personal writeup to share with the greater community and hopefully give additional insight. These boots are not cheap and if it helps you decide on one over the other (or none at all): mission accomplished! I am comparing my set of Imperial Boots (IB) Biker Boots w/ their new 'accurate soles' from late 2020. It's possible they have updated their design since. My CROWPROPS (CP) Biker Boots were from late 2021. It's also possible they have updated their design since. Because my CP set is custom made from home it will ultimately be more accurate (more on that later). I used the excellent Boot tutorial by @cheesewhoopyas my starting point. http://forum.501stpathfinders.com/index.php?/topic/19708-biker-scout-boots-tutorial/ Lastly, I will be aligning with the current Scout Trooper CRL (2022 year). IB Boots https://www.imperialboots.com/product/bikerscout-boot/ I first started with a pair of IB Boots in late 2020. Coincidentally, this was when IB released their new 'screen-accurate' soles and I was lucky enough to be one of the first customers to get my hands on it. The quality is superb with excellent materials used. And it's made well! At $270 USD, this is the more expensive offering of the two. After about a year getting my costume in order, it was determined that the IB boots won't pass Basic approval based on a few things. First, there is a horizontal stitch on the back near the heal that needed concealment: an easy fix. Second, the color of the sole is precariously dark (note: I did pass Basic without any modifications, though I have a feeling it probably won't pass now). And third, the dog bone on the top isn't shaped correctly. After carefully attempting to cut and reshape the dog bone, I successfully passed Basic. After dog bone modifications However, I wasn't satisfied with my work and to go further for Lancer requires a rethink. CP Boots Long: https://crowprops.bigcartel.com/product/biker-shadow-scout-boots-accurate-soles Short: https://crowprops.bigcartel.com/product/biker-base-boots-accurate-soles Which lead me to CROWPROPS, which has an interesting set of offerings: they give you the choice of either a completed, ready-made boot, or a short version where they essentially sell you a short white boot and leave the rest up to you to finish (adding the vinyl covering etc). Both versions include their 'screen-accurate' soles. The ready-made version is $200 USD and the short version is $100 USD , both significantly cheaper than IB. I decided to go with the short version, not because it was half the price, but I found their ready-made version looked a little frumpy. And at least from photos, it looked aesthetically worse than my IB boots that I already had. The quality is equally superb to that of the IB offering though. And if that wasn't enough, it is softer and more comfortable! Though we shall see how durable these will be in the coming years. So a few months of on and off being a junior cobbler and using the CRL religiously, I'm proud to say I produced a boot that I think is more accurate than what I started out with with the IB Boots! Detailed Analysis As mentioned earlier, because I custom wrapped the CP boots using the latest CRL, it is no contest that my finished CP boot is more accurate than the IB pair. In addition, the following photos show the post dog bone adjustments to my IB boots, which isn't the most pretty to say the least. I'd say the following comparison is to compare how the soles of the boots compare with the CRL as well as the areas where the IB boot needs improvement to align with the CRL. Boot Soles Strictly in shape and design, they both look quite similar and closely aligned with the CRL. Interestingly, the narrowest part of the IB sole is 2.5" wide whereas the CP sole is 3.0" I did not find the fit any different between the two however. I can only conclude that it is probably only an external design choice without really altering the interior space. The CRL does not specify this highly specific measurement so no worries about it! Another interesting detail that the CRL photo illustrates are these tiny stitch-like detailing along the perimeter of the sole. IB does not represent these at all, whereas CP does! IB left. CP right. The color is where the IB boots fall short. I think they are too dark and brown. Looking at reference photos and it's clear, they should be tan. CP's sole color is much more aligned with the CRL. Another weird thing about the IB sole is how the front dramatically ramps up like a banana. CP has more of a conservative ramp, which to my eye aligns better with the CRL. Toe Strip Moving up from the sole, we arrive at the toe strip. Please not this is a Lancer requirement only! The CRL states "The toe strip is approximately 1/2 inch in height." Unfortunately, the IB Boots uses 1" strips. Dog Bone Next is the dog bone. This is the area that I had issues with getting Basic approval and ultimately pushed me to redo my boots completely. For the IB boots, the shaping was more like a sanitary towel vs a dog bone. Even though the CRL doesn't specify the spacing of the stitching detail, IB's stitching is spaced out to 1/16" which to me is too close compared to the reference photos. I opted for a 1/4" spacing which I believe aligns better. To illustrate this point, I approximately distilled the two shapes to it's fundamentals. Rear There are a couple items to address in the back. First, the IB boots have a horizontal stitch near the heal that needs to be concealed. Some white paint, or if you go for a dirty look, just some grime can work. The next item I think is either for Lancer approval only, or just good to have: IB boots come with a vertical vinyl trim piece along the spine of the boot for decorative/finishing purposes. I actually quite like it as it gives it a sharp, finished look. Unfortunately I think the proper method is to not have this extra vinyl piece and only have stitching detail along the spine. Top IB boots also have stitching along the top edge of the boot, at about 1/16" away from the edge. No specifics in the CRL but the reference photos indicates this stitching is a bit further away from the edge, 1/8" perhaps? That concludes the analysis. I hope it is useful in some way! If there are anything I missed, or is incorrect please let me know! -------------------------- The next few things are added tips, tricks, and additions that I found useful while working on my boots. Some are already well known but it's nice to reinforce! * @Chopper's great idea of sewing an elastic band inside the boot behind where the holster is located. The elastic wraps around your calf so the boots don't droop while you troop! * Doubling up the vinyl material (or another sturdy material) for the tube portion of the boot. This also helps prevent droopage. * Adding loops at the top opening of the spine. It doesn't use a lot more vinyl and gives you a nice, finished look. * Adding pull straps to the tongue of the boot to help ingress. The pull strap can easily live within the boot velcro to the inner wall when stowed. 3 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chopper Posted March 5, 2022 Share Posted March 5, 2022 Excellent write up, Andy, and very helpful! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BikerScout007 Posted March 5, 2022 Share Posted March 5, 2022 Well done, Andy! And nice job on those custom boots. They look fantastic 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShaunPug Posted March 5, 2022 Share Posted March 5, 2022 Very helpful indeed! Thank you for this! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aradun Posted March 6, 2022 Share Posted March 6, 2022 This is great Andy and will help future Pathfinders when weighing options. Thanks for taking the time to post this. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meowied_Cass Posted March 6, 2022 Share Posted March 6, 2022 I found this very helpful! I plan on doing my boots DIY style but i enjoyed the comparison thread and the helpful tips! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harbinger Posted March 7, 2022 Share Posted March 7, 2022 Great write-up, Andy - I very much look forward to where this takes you. The CP soles do indeed look more accurate than the IB, especially the faux stitching on the tops - I didn't even notice IB's was lacking it. For purely useless reference, the narrowest part of the soles on my Sierra Sneakers is ~2.75" at the narrowest point. Adjusting for shrinkage from the 40-something year-old rubber CP is likely the more accurate of the two as well. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woobiee Posted March 7, 2022 Author Share Posted March 7, 2022 8 hours ago, Harbinger said: Great write-up, Andy - I very much look forward to where this takes you. The CP soles do indeed look more accurate than the IB, especially the faux stitching on the tops - I didn't even notice IB's was lacking it. For purely useless reference, the narrowest part of the soles on my Sierra Sneakers is ~2.75" at the narrowest point. Adjusting for shrinkage from the 40-something year-old rubber CP is likely the more accurate of the two as well. Good to know! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harbinger Posted March 7, 2022 Share Posted March 7, 2022 You bet! There are some details IB seems to have nailed better, to be fair. Their mid/rear sole is otherwise closer to the originals. Reference: (Yes, I had to paint mine. Couldn't find tan ones!) 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donovan Posted March 8, 2022 Share Posted March 8, 2022 Just ordered my crow props base boots yesterday, thanks for the excellent thread 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TreeHuggerMatt Posted March 8, 2022 Share Posted March 8, 2022 Fantastic write up! Wonder how they both compare to chefs latest boots? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BikerScout007 Posted March 8, 2022 Share Posted March 8, 2022 15 minutes ago, TreeHuggerMatt said: Fantastic write up! Wonder how they both compare to chefs latest boots? Chef makes his boots the traditional costumer way, which is to buy a donor boot and put vinyl covers over top. What Crowprops and IB did that was different was to create soles that were replicas of the Sierra Sneakers used in ROTJ. They also made the boot covers from leather like the film boots. Just to be clear, it is NOT a requirement to have replica soles for either Level 1 or 2. And it is perfectly acceptable to use marine vinyl to cover the boots for both levels. Leather is also not required. Chef's boots will get you to Level 2, provided all requirements are met. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TreeHuggerMatt Posted March 8, 2022 Share Posted March 8, 2022 cheers boss! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harbinger Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 Chef sews his covers on though, like the prop department did (and you kind of have to if you have HiTecs, IMO) - not sure anyone else is. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BikerScout007 Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 22 minutes ago, Harbinger said: Chef sews his covers on though, like the prop department did (and you kind of have to if you have HiTecs, IMO) - not sure anyone else is. Also not a requirement for either 1 or 2. And my Hi-Tecs are glued so anything is possible! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harbinger Posted March 12, 2022 Share Posted March 12, 2022 Mine are too! But I have a feeling sewing would be more comfortable, mo more breathability/give to the fabric post-glue. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CROW62 Posted March 19, 2022 Share Posted March 19, 2022 Giovanni here, after read this post, I am going to make changes tou our biker boots, thanks for your effort. 3 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BikerScout007 Posted March 19, 2022 Share Posted March 19, 2022 12 minutes ago, CROW62 said: Giovanni here, after read this post, I am going to make changes tou our biker boots, thanks for your effort. Thank you Gio! We really appreciate your open mindedness and willingness to work with us to make the best possible prop. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CROW62 Posted March 19, 2022 Share Posted March 19, 2022 20 minutes ago, BikerScout007 said: Thank you Gio! We really appreciate your open mindedness and willingness to work with us to make the best possible prop. No Problem, ,I printed all the images in this thread and put in a wall to let see to my team the changes in the current and future orders 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harbinger Posted March 21, 2022 Share Posted March 21, 2022 On 3/19/2022 at 12:41 PM, CROW62 said: No Problem, ,I printed all the images in this thread and put in a wall to let see to my team the changes in the current and future orders If you want direct reference to real soles I am happy to help! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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