Ever forward - CRL discussion for new discoveries!

[TB5994]

Everyone has a say fella, I guess that's the point, i'm just making the most noise at the moment

[Heatshock]

not gonna comment any more as tony knows my views on it.

cgi costume regs are always contentious. they arent the same as old trilogy. kinda f the reason why i think the kashyyyk belongs back on ct.net. no other prequel variant is farmed out lie the kashyyyk is.

 

marcel and rob - i take your point but neither of your have been in crl discussions for the prequel cossies. its a different kettle of fish. you got 3d renders, you got screen grabs, you got back ground shots, up front shots. they all change. if we pander to every individuals interpretation we wont have a standard, we would have a free for all. so the community chooses a standard to maintain. it may not be perfect, but it is what it is.

 

the belief is that the 3d render is what the original design for the placement, colour and shape of the armour was supposed to be like. cos we all know short cuts are taken for the movie. sometimes less . detail. sometimes more colour to recreate weathering etc. we have this problem all the time w the clone crls on ct.net as well as the gm crl on 53rd FAC.

 

to those worried. theres a huge lead time. tony has missed the boat on the current submission. there will be a discussion. summary. only if there is enough support (and thats a HUGE IF) for change, then it will be put up for further discussion. then a consultation for a further 6 to 12 months. so we are talking about prob 18 to 24months before any change. than in addition a grace period again to allow for people working off the current CRL as it currently stands.

 

tony's pictures bring up an interesting question. he has been given clearance on those pictures.

 

1. wrong colour greebs on chest straps

2. wrong colour greebs in the bicep pieces

3. no back tank detail

4. wrong colour cummerbund

5. wrong placement of pouches

6. wrong colour boots

 

now i am relatively new to the uk garrison. i have not been a GML. i have not trained the current or any GMLs. I have cleared one or two 501st costumes though.

 

even you accepted that 1 to 3 and 5 needed changing tony. did you get clearance before or after those changes were made then? i only ask as in my limited experience, ive always been asked to resubmit before i was.

 

you disagree with our concensus choice - i can respect that. but even with the picture you have provided, the light grey single tone 'bund doesnt match the one on that screen grab either. THAT is the point of trying to get a consensus agreement. We know the cgi piccies are inconsistent. we were trying to set a standard that we all could agree to so that everyone could sing off the same hymm sheet. it aint perfect, but it is what it is.

 

thank you gentlemen.

 

keep it civil.

[TB5994]

then show us the images that back your crl...... unless you can do that, your point is null and void!

 

at least if you do have a point, base it with fact!

 

statements like "and thats a HUGE IF" clearly displays your lack of interest in any debate, which makes me chuckle, bsn hasnt changed for the better tbh, at least in the past, desisions were made or changed basedon fact and eevidence, not just mythical pictures nobody has seen....

 

somone give me a nudge when common senses kicks in, I just feel sorry for new members....

[4505Marcel]

I've pointed out I haven't studied the Kashyyyk in detail, but going by screen grabs alone. Are we saying thier is several colour variants seen on screen? Or are we saying that the screen seen Kashyyyk doesn't match the 3d models or whatever that were used for the CRL?

[4505Marcel]

I have asked Jim to open up a new thread, which is going to be placed under the CRL link. Basically it is going to be a picture reference section, now Im mainly looking for CLEAR screen grabs, as that is first and foremost what we will be using for the CRL. It would also be benificial to have other sources posted , such as the MOM us white scouts use or anything relavant really. Not really sure what this 3D reference is that keeps getting brought up, so please feel free to get that up on here also.

 

The CRL was only recently posted and is a work in progress so, Im really keen to nail this asap. I would like to see this discussed and fimailised as best we can within say 2-3 months. Picture reference certainly needs adding for clarity

 

Thanks

[Griffin-X]

I have asked Jim to open up a new thread, which is going to be placed under the CRL link. Basically it is going to be a picture reference section, now Im mainly looking for CLEAR screen grabs, as that is first and foremost what we will be using for the CRL. It would also be benificial to have other sources posted , such as the MOM us white scouts use or anything relavant really. Not really sure what this 3D reference is that keeps getting brought up, so please feel free to get that up on here also. The CRL was only recently posted and is a work in progress so, Im really keen to nail this asap. I would like to see this discussed and fimailised as best we can within say 2-3 months. Picture reference certainly needs adding for clarity Thanks

 

Done boss.

[TB5994]

Got a link to the thread Jim?

[Chef]

http://forum.bikerscout.net/index.php?showforum=103

 

 

seek and ye shall find!

[Heatshock]

Ok like I said, u know my views, so I'm not gonna argue.

For a long time thre was no movement. Then came mr bungle. His scratch build of all the hard parts were based on the 3d renders. His costume build was based on the 3d renders. His build formed the basis of the current CRL

If our frame of reference is changing from 3d render to screen accuracy, then I can say lots of the current CRL won't apply. So lets start from scratch again.

 

Let the discussions begin.

But nothing changes till we get consensus, agreed?

 

If we are going to make this major change, let's rethink the bdu as well, as the British bdu is starting to get difficult to find.

[Grumpy]

So, will the currently approved Kashyyyk Troopers have to change anything, or are they "Grandfathered" in already?

 

I've changed a few things on mine over these past few years to catch up on my "upgrades" because mine was approved back then (2009) and then we discovered new found ideas and reference pictures, so will more changes be required?

Are we going to go down the route like the recently discovered Blu-ray pics for the Biker Scout and change the CRL's yet again?

 

The Kashyyyk CRL's are not "carved in stone" as some would put it, but are still listed as a "work in progress."

Well, it seems that the work is continuing. Let's see what happens now.

 

I haven't been pushing and promoting this costume for over the past three and a half years for nothing.

 

I don't think it will be final anytime soon, but we can work on it TOGETHER, right?

[TB5994]

Nailed it in one Matt, nobody is asking anyone (else) to change an already cleared costume, its just the CRL needs addressing clearly, and based on images people can work towards.

[Heatshock]

Same here man, all the good ones do.

I even have a bund like Tony's before upgrading

I think those currently cleared should be grandfathered-in like tradition

 

In the interest of fairness, we need time to discuss, agree and consult before we throw out the current CRL

I propose a 18mth time frame. With a further 6mth grace (like when we changed the animated clone rule over on ct.net)

 

[TB5994]

nothing takes more than 2 years to decide.... 3 months is ample time to show evidence, discuss and evaluate, based on the facts.

[Heatshock]

you have to take into account

1. picture gathering - which we have only just begun doing

2. decision on what we need to change

3. once you decide you want to change the bund for instance, one tone? 2 tone, brown camo? tan camo?what kind of camo?

4. reinvestigate the bdu

5. the greebs

6. detail of the puches

7. once we agree, what about the size

8. people already in the middle of builds - remember some people are ready in the mddle of builds. for those overseas now for stance, it may be a month before thy even receive their stuff. then build itetc.

 

remember we are a world wide audience, not just you. and not just the ukg. you want thing reconsider tony,we will. we ave to do it right. with enough time or people to discuss and agree changes. a timely schedule, not a schedule you want.

 

remember we are change what everyone should be aimimg for, its on a scale not akin to a single garison level.

 

also if u note i did not say more than 2 years, but at most.

[Heatshock]

the last time alone we had 6 months for members to consider.ad that was after we ad experiments on colours and shades etc

 

now if u use your usual influence to get my current DL to force a 3 month time fame on me, i will abide by the rules and listen to my DL. cos i realise your are an exGML of the UKG and hence a very impt person

[TB5994]

Bdu's? they are still available, cheaper than ever, we don't stop striving for the correct bikerscout parts because they are 30+years old do we?

 

I don't want to reinvent the wheel, LFL did that when they made the film, we just have to look at the screen captures, compare them to the CRL, and see if a matches b... if not, change it...

 

The schedule isn't for me fella, as you pointed out, the grandfather rights cover me too, like it or not, I just would like to see on screen to costume consistency for the future...

 

It doesn't matter where people are in their builds... if they clear pre change, they fall into the old CRL, unless their GML over rules... if they won't make the CRL cross over, then dispensation can be granted do to circumstance... its only a costume club at the end of the day, not the Changing of the Guards at Buck Palace...

[TB5994]

"now if u use your usual influence to get my current DL to force a 3 month time fame on me, i will abide by the rules and listen to my DL. cos i realise your are an exGML of the UKG and hence a very impt person"

 

Awww now come on... the posts on the boards this evening CLEARLY show being the ex GML of the UKG means absolutely NAFF all to anyone... The Current DL has made changes to the Bikerscout CRL within his last term at the helm... that was less than a year... nothing takes 2 years Nath...

 

"I'm not a very important person, i'n a very naughty boy"

 

***edited for language***

[Heatshock]

warning no. 1 tony. pls keep things polite and civil. we are here to discuss the crl

 

things have changed - the last around of animated clones in animated gear had at least. 6 month grace period ie the CRL still applied 6 months from publication. that was to make it fair to all.

 

the biker had years of research to back it up so the changes made were already known abt. what we havent even done is the research. oh the joy we had trying to determine the base coat colour.

 

remember the base colour was based on MR Bungles interpretation of the colours on the 3d renders, NOT screen grabs.

 

if we want a change we will indeed have to reinvent the wheel. its cos the current CRL is based off the 3d renders not the screen caps. we arent just gonna have to discuss the parts you want.

 

nate

[TB5994]

? your comment was either a strangely flattering complement, given the circumstances, or a cheap dig at me.... now i'm betting on the latter, either way, I meant my retort, the swear word is not directed at anyone, just emphasizing the statement, we are all over 18 on these forums, I don't see where I was not being civil, given my interpretation of YOUR comment (which I may be wrong, therefore I apologize) it would be you that is not being civil...

[Heatshock]

yes i realise that as an exGML, you are used to being right all the time (and from what i heard you were a damn fine one, and were usually right). but unlike the trilogy costumes, clone stuff is often a compromise of colour, shape, material and form. also being a smallish community, i like to consult with our members as a wider body, because, a you said before everyone should, ad will have a say.

 

what do our american brothers think about the dpm/bdu question?easily available? want to rediscuss? someone like to put something else forward? Please let us know!

 

no tony, no insult or compliment, just repeating the implied importance in you earlier comments. and thank you, much more civil and polite. yes we are adults here Tony, lets trying acting like it can we?.

 

yes marcel did change it. it was a well research costume even then. despite than, when the change came in, should the membership have been consulted. i think yes. but i listened to my DL. like the rules said we should.

[TB5994]

I cant believe, since 2006, nobody to my knowledge has tried dying US Desert cammo? its not far off ours, the worry is, its going to contain more poly...

 

I fear we maybe trying to find a solution to a problem that will arise in about 5-10 years time, when original stocks have dried up and repro stuff is non existent...

 

I bring you to the UKG's internal "battle" with a group of prospective US Colonial marines and the Marine "Armourers" and RI GML... they can only source the reproduction combats from one person... still not stopping them.

[Heatshock]

rofl true. you gotta love this game tony, dont yer?

i know. maybe someone would like to exeriment? volunteers guys?

how about the canadian deserts - theres a new guy in canadian military?

 

now with crows62 boots not only being possibly NOT available, but in white, perhaps a new boot concensus too? the only pics of the boot looking like kc pit crewes were the 3d and promo pics. although i admit that its been a while since i looked at screen grabs.

[Death Recon]

Ok wow, if I have 3 months to build my armour to fit in the "old CRL" then I might as well wait to begin till I get home later next year...

I've been away from home for the better part of a year and will only be home for around 3 months just to leave for nearly another year.

 

Personally it wasn't hard to find the BDU'S here in Canada but I know a lot of guys in the US were having some trouble finding local shops with some.

As for things posaibly changing or specifically the colours changing, I don't really mind but real time constraints must be thought of.

 

My plan was to begin my cummerbund when I got home next week but I might as well wait untill the big bad boys have it out with each other and see who comes out on top...

[Heatshock]

rofl man , 3 months is what tony wants.

 

there are no big boys here DR, we are a community,always have been, always will be. We wont change things without a concensus.

 

like i said, if the community chooses to stay with the status quo as your generic and a more screen accurate version as a SWAMPER version i would be all for that. Nows the time to let us know. i quite like this idea as we can retain our current CRL which is more 3drender version and also tip of the hat to the amt of work Mr Bungle did for our community (which must mean at least as much as Tony's ex-GML status)

 

i (mind you, i am only an kashyyyktrooper armourer, so take hat thats worth) suggest a more appropriate 18 mths. i would have chat to ur gml as well, military folk on deployment have often got special consideration.

 

the other problem with this cossie is either time to build or time for one of the very few makers to make an item. 3 months is unrealistic.

[Death Recon]

Well if there's going to be a "swamper" status I will be working towards that... LoL so when's the discussion start for that?