Gloria's ROTJ Biker Scout Build Thread

[Glory530]

Hello! I'm Gloria, DS/ID-50191 from Great Lakes Garrison in Michigan, and I'm starting a Biker Scout Build. My aim is to go for level 2 approval, so I'll be building to those requirements. I'm only 5'2", kinda curvy, small feet, and have an extremely short torso, so those factors will be adding some challenge, but I'll get there.

Armor wise - I've already purchased and received my SC kit and have almost all the soft parts or materials to make them. It helps with my anxiety if I have all the major things I need before I start a project!

I'll post photos and descriptions along the way or when I have questions, so I'm hoping you guys can help me out if I get stuck. And if anyone sees anything I did wrong, PLEASE stop me before I get too far.

And away we go!

[Glory530]

I'm going to start with the flight suit (and then vest) first, so then I can fit the armor over those. I got the Red Kap coveralls in a size large enough to fit my hips, knowing I was going to have to take EVERYTHING else in and significantly shorten the torso. Here's what it looked like before I did the alterations. Needless to say, I have a huge pile of material that was removed!

With everything but the inseam taken in or up, the suit fits MUCH better now. You'll notice it's still just a little baggy, and that's because I got it as tight as I could without impeding my ability to move, bend, sit, reach, etc. Also, this is going to be my "warm" costume (no more freezing my butt off in my Officer when it's 15 degrees F outside!), so I fit the suit over my fleece-lined pants and a non-bulky sweatshirt. I'm still going to hem the pants a little shorter, I just haven't done it yet.

I am fortunate in that a fellow garrison member who is fairly close to my size leant me her patterns for the suede patches, so I don't have to make those from scratch! I lined them up and traced them on my suit to make sure they will work for me. Here's some pictures with the trace lines. I have one with the knee armor held in place, and it shows that the patches will extend below the top of the knee armor. Hopefully this is OK, and this appears to be the case in the CRL photos as well. I am assuming that the CRL statement "finishing above the knee" in regard to the suede patches is talking about the center of my knee and not the top of the knee armor?

Please let me know if the suede patch size/placement is not OK, and I can make some easy pattern modifications before moving forward.

    

[BikerScout007]

Hi Glory!

Welcome to the Pathfinders forum. 

First thing you might want to check out is our new armor build video!

As for soft goods, we have quite a few useful posts to check out:

http://forum.501stpathfinders.com/forum/145-biker-scout-soft-parts/

You want your thigh patches to finish above your whole knee, not just the center.  You can use this photo as a guide:

In fact, we have a whole store of source images in the Scoutopedia:

http://www.501stpathfinders.com/scoutopedia.php

I hope these help get you on your way!  Please let us know any other questions you have.  

PS -- Oh and before you ask, your pouches need to be 6x5x2  -- don't modify them because of your height.  We will not hold this against you for your Lancer app  

[Chopper]

Hi Gloria, welcome to the pathfinders.

In addition to what Mickey wrote, you might want to curve that hard angle on your front riding patches a bit.

Good luck with your build and let us know if you have any questions.

 

 

[Aradun]

Great work on tailoring the flight suit! Looks great. Adjust the patches as noted by Chopper and you should be good to go.

[Glory530]

Thank you all for your feedback!

I did watch the armor build video last weekend - so many great tips and instructions! I have so much more confidence now going into the armor build part of this project.

And now with the helpful pointers above, I've finished my flight suit. Per Chopper's feedback, I rounded off the top corners of the front patches, and thanks to BikeScout007's clarification, I raised the bottom of both patches up so that they end about 2.25 inches above the top of my kneecap.

I almost forgot about the elastic straps (I went with 2 inches wide for level 2) - that's why they were not part of my initial photos. Good thing I remembered before sewing on the suede. Per the supplied reference photo, I positioned the straps so that the vertical center is at the halfway point between the bottom of where my belt is going to sit and my knee. 

In preparation for attaching the suede patches, I seam ripped the inseam, butt seam, and the front seam between the zipper and the inseam. Then I sewed the elastic ends under where the suede will go and pinned it in place just outside the patch area so it wouldn't move on me. I made the strap length so that when the suit is worn, the straps would sit against my leg just tight enough so that there is no slack.

On to the suede - I'm so lucky to have the only Tandy in Michigan less than a half hour from my house. I bought a pigskin soft suede split (in black, of course). With the patterns efficiently placed, I had enough for all of the thigh patches and plenty of extra for the butt flap (which will come later, after I build my belt).

Instead of just sewing on the patches and hoping they didn't move (the suede is to too thick for pins), I opted to follow what f3tt4l1f3 did in his incredibly helpful photo-filled tutorial within the undersuit mods tutorial - Heat n Bond! I used this to stick the patches on the suit so they would stay in place while I sewed them around just inside the perimeter to the suit and seam allowances. Never mind the wet spots, that was just me removing the chalk lines since I didn't need them anymore at this point.

 

The next part was kind of a nightmare. I sewed the seams I ripped back together. The part between the zipper and the inseam in particular! With the added double suede thickness, my sewing machine wasn't particularly happy with me, even with the leather needle, by it trudged on like a champ. Again, not being able to use pins was frustrating, but I have some really great sewing clips that saved the day here.

So now, here is the finished suit laying on the bed and with me wearing it. Hopefully it's good since I did the patch preview before sewing! Oh, and I hemmed the pants too, so now they're not too long.

 

 

[Chopper]

Nice work!

[Glory530]

Some questions for the experts, since I tend to over-obsess about colors:

In preparation for starting work on my armor this weekend, I sorted through my SC kit to take a look at what was included, what's useable for level 2, and made a list of what I still need to buy. In this process, I noticed that the included 1.5 inch cotton webbing for the belt drop boxes isn't as bright white as all the other white stuff I have, and I'm not sure if this will be an issue, as I was under the impression that shoulder bridge, chest to back webbing, belt webbing, cummerbund/codpiece, and pouch shades of white need to match. Regardless, I need more 1.5 inch white webbing for the chest to back attachment since the kit includes elastic for this.

Unfortunately, Joann's doesn't carry cotton webbing, so I grabbed some (returnable) polyester webbing that is a brighter white.

Here are the questions:

1. Would polyester be allowed for level 2, or must the webbing be actual cotton for level 2?
2. If cotton is absolutely required, is the fact that it is not as bright as the other straps/elastic an issue?
3. Again, if cotton is absolutely required, does anyone have a recommended source? Preferably something that matches what I have from SC? Doing a quick search, I am only finding the 1.5 inch width in heavy-weight. Not sure if that will be OK or it needs to be normal weight.

I have included a photo below for reference. From left to right: polyester webbing, back of belt webbing from SC kit, pouch fabric (duck cloth), shoulder bridge elastic, cummerbund/codpiece sateen fabric, and the cotton webbing from the SC kit laying across everything.

Please let me know your thoughts! Thanks so much!

[BikerScout007]

Okay we don't get super picky about the color of the straps and elastics.  Just that they are generally the same color.  And that's only if you are doing the off-white pouch, chest and dropbox strap thing.  In that case -- those three things should be the same off-white.

If you are just doing white, it's fine.  So in short, to answer your 3 questions:

1. Yes it has to be cotton for L2.  

2. As long as they are all white, it's fine the shades don't precisely match.  Or if you do off-white (like by tea-staining), then your pouches, drop box and chest straps have to all match.  The other elastics dont matter.  

3. Heavy cotton webbing is fine.  That's what many of us use, including myself.   Something like this will do your Scout and probably 4 others:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B086J96YJY/ref=sspa_dk_detail_1?pd_rd_i=B086J9T3DG&pd_rd_w=eucvg&content-id=amzn1.sym.f734d1a2-0bf9-4a26-ad34-2e1b969a5a75&pf_rd_p=f734d1a2-0bf9-4a26-ad34-2e1b969a5a75&pf_rd_r=NZ3XX8E98YN97W64VHQ2&pd_rd_wg=558pL&pd_rd_r=41f563e3-0274-4394-9f51-f991138a148d&s=kitchen&sp_csd=d2lkZ2V0TmFtZT1zcF9kZXRhaWw&th=1

[Glory530]

One BIG setback last weekend, but also some progress since then.

I was working on the back and chest armor, got everything fitted up, shoulder straps painstakingly measured and trimmed, but the sides are too wide on me. So my husband and I had the idea a bending the center crease open just a couple degrees with the heat gun since we had successfully added some bend to the shoulder straps. Well, with the heat gun on low, the crease went from non-pliable to liquid in less than the blink of an eye and warped beyond repair. Needless to say, I am devastated. I ordered a replacement piece right away (last Saturday) from SC, and the website says it's a 20-30 day lead time. All I got from them was a PayPal receipt, so I really, really hope the order was received!

On to the better news. I finished the tank last Sunday. I'm really bad at placing decals straight, and I have the Lego sets to prove it. But I had my Cricut out for another project, so I cut out some paper strips the same size as the decals for placement and practice. Then I make some pencil marks to line up the real ones to. I used the Scoutopedia pictures (so helpful!) for decal, greeblie, and rivet placement. Here's the finished product:

 

This weekend, I completed the belt! Thankfully the SC belt comes already curved, but I did need to curve it a little more to fit the curve of my waist. Since I am now terrified of heat guns, I opted for my hairdryer instead. 12 passes at each "joint" on the high setting did the trick, as the plastic was just barely starting to show the beginning signs of stress when I stopped bending. The cotton webbing and drop boxes went pretty easy other than the time spent in front of the mirror measuring, adjusting, and pinning until the boxes were just right at about an inch below the belt. Here are some photos of me wearing it.

 

Yes, I know the belt looks REALLY high on me. Have I mentioned I have an extremely short torso? The belt is on my waist but pushed low enough to start digging into the tops of my hip bones. In an initial fitup with chest, back, and belt taped on/together before my chest piece bit the dust, it looked as if the gap between the chest piece (with it about an inch above the bra line) and the belt will be somewhere between 1 and 2 inches, just enough for the cummerbund to peek through a little. Hopefully that won't be an issue for approval, because sadly I can't change my torso length.

Thermal detonator is in process, just waiting on the E6000 to cure. After that, I'll just keep doing whatever I can without my chest piece!

[Chopper]

Hey Gloria, don't worry too much about the heat gun accident. It's happened to pretty much all of us at one time or another, including myself.

As for the belt, that's a tough one. Yes, it does look high. Usually I tell folks to find your navel and put the top edge of the belt just below that. If you lengthen the webbing on the back of the belt, are you able to reposition it lower? My concern is what you mentioned about the bund, as only having an inch or two showing is going to leave the pouches hanging over your belt.

Melody @KOtrooper , I know you usually do ST stuff, but do you have any suggestions on the scout side?

[KOtrooper]

I have to cheat with my biker scout belt (and shoretooper costume) to get the right look. Mine basically sits on my hips and not my waist. Cheating down gives me 5" or more for my bund and is a cleaner look.

So far my belt stays put just fine (it closes with Velcro in the back). If I'm concerned with it slipping down, I'd put some Velcro on the flight suit to help hold it in place.

Sent from my Pixel 5a using Tapatalk

[Glory530]

Thank you both so much for the belt feedback!

I was building with the hopes of going for level 2 approval, so that's why I had built the belt to go around my waist. I agree though, it would look better around my hips with the top about at navel level (photos below), but then I couldn't go for level 2.

 

So I see two options here:

1. Continue building to level 2 specs. I'd have my 1-2 inch gap between the belt and the chest armor and pouches would hang way below the belt (but based on previous comments, I was led to believe this would be acceptable, as long as the pouches were the right size). It would look funny, but it would be a higher level of screen accuracy. But is it though since none of the scouts in the film/exhibits looked like this? 

2. Give up on level 2 and wear the belt around my hips as suggested. I'd have to rebuild it with longer webbing in the back and also remove, lower, and resew the black elastic around the legs at the new midpoint between knees and center of the belt. Also, with the belt lower and the fact that my hips are much larger than my waist, my cummerbund would need to be a weird bell shape so that there's not a big gap around the top. In my opinion, this would be the more screen accurate look for people of my body type. I'd also have a costume that meets every level 2 spec except the belt worn around the waist, which might drive my perfectionist brain a little nuts. But it would look better.

I'd really welcome everyone's feedback and thoughts on these options, as I'm really not sure what I want to do now.

[KOtrooper]

Don't tell anyone but I cheated my belt down and am also a Lancer.

For the bund, I added extra Velcro on the inside flap. It's really hard to tell in the photos (if at all) but it's actually wider at my hips and narrows towards the bust. Gives me a cleaner look and I don't have a bunch of excess bunching towards the chest/back armor.

Sent from my Pixel 5a using Tapatalk

[Glory530]

More progress!

Belt - I sized it to fit lower, with the top at about navel level. I needed longer webbing, which meant rebuilding the whole thing, but it looks sooo much better lower! I also lowered the elastic straps around the legs so they are recentered between the new belt bottom and my knees.

Chest armor - I received my new chest piece, and the boiling water method for bending in the sides (and also putting a little curve into the shortened shoulder straps) is a win! For reference, I brought a big pot of water to a boil, dipped in the area that needed to be bent/curved for a count of 30 seconds, removed it and immediately bent and held it in place until it cooled. I have seen that some do a cold water quench instead of waiting, but I just went with holding it so I wouldn't affect the bend in moving the piece to the sink or a pot of cold water.

Chest/back armor - I cut the slits and added a cotton webbing adjustable "belt" to join the front and back around the sides (move give to allow for cold weather gear, tighter for indoor troops). I also added the fuzzy Velcro on the undersides of the shoulders and 1 inch elastic on top to complete the shoulder bridges.

Thermal detonator - Finished, minus the clips. I have them, I just need to get the right screws to attach them.

   

[Aradun]

Excellent work!

[Glory530]

Back to my build after a VERY busy trooping month! Since my last update, I have attached the clips to the thermal detonator and assembled/attached the shoulder bells. As I'm going for level 2, I used zip ties and zip tie anchors to attach the shoulders to the chest/back armor and used 1/2 inch elastic to secure them to my arms through my armpits.

 

Here are updated full-body front and back photos to show the TD clipped to the belt and the shoulders in place. I did not trim the shoulder bell length. Browsing the Scoutopedia, I figured the Larry Holt picture was best to gauge the proportional length of my shoulder bells to my upper arm length by bending my elbow the same way he did. By just looking in the mirror and at the photo, I thought my shoulder bell lengths looked good. However, when I put the two photos side to side, I'm not so sure. What do you guys think? I can certainly trim them if it looks like I need to!

 

Quote

 

 

[Chopper]

I think you can probably take off another 1/2" from the bottom of the shoulder bells.

[Glory530]

OK, I've run into a bit of a problem, and I'm wondering if anyone can help. I'm working on the vest, and I made a pattern from a t-shirt. As I always do when I make my own patterns, I did a trial run with muslin. The good news is the fit is good. The bad news is something weird is going on with the sleeves. When I put the armor on over the vest, the bottom of the sleeve is not parallel to the bottom of the shoulder bells. Note, I have an elastic loop on the shoulder bells that goes through my armpit, so I'm not sure if that is pulling the vest, but if it were the case, I would think the sleeve would be longer in the center and shorter towards the armpit. Maybe it's an issue with the muslin being so thin that the sleeve is not sitting right? I even pinned the vest sleeves to the flight suit sleeves before putting on the armor to make sure they were sitting right, and the same phenomenon occurred. 

I'm not sure what's going on or how to fix this. Has anyone run into this, or does anyone have any ideas? I would appreciate any advice! Photos below are wearing the vest with armor and the vest lying flat (note: I moved the closure to the front for the muslin version so I can put it on myself).

[BikerScout007]

The sleeve looks like it's higher in the back than the front?  Is that because of the elastic pulling it up in the back?

[Pinkflamingos6]

Gloria, I have the same issue when putting on my armor over the vest. I also use 1/4" elastic around the sleeves to keep the bells in place. I believe the issue might be that the elastic is pulling on the sleeves causing the sleeve to bunch up/move.

My fix is whenever I'm suiting up, I or I have someone help pull the sleeve out from under the shoulders and make sure the elastic is sitting properly around my bicep.

I like to put my arms out at the side so they can pull the sleeve out from under the elastic and then adjust/position the strap so it's going around my bicep and doesn't interfere with the sleeves. 

Not properly fixed:

Fixed:

I hope this helps and makes sense!

[Glory530]

OK, I checked for pulled up fabric as suggested and had my husband help me pull the sleeves straight, but unfortunately, they were still slanted. In fact, when I started at the beginning to try and figure out where the issue was happening, I noticed that when just putting the vest on over the flight suit with no armor, the sleeve edges were still slanted forward. 

So what I did was have my husband draw a straight line around my bicep on the muslin sleeve, even with the bottom edge of the shoulder bell. I seem ripped the sleeve apart, cut at the line, traced it on my patten, and offset it down by 1.25 inches. The result was a sine wave shape for the bottom of the sleeve. Kind of strange, but I made and reattached some new sleeves to see what would happen, and voila, with the sleeves pulled down, they are now parallel to the bottom edge of the shoulder bells! 

[jennyruth]

Looks like you came up with a great fix  I know you've already adjusted your belt, but I wanted to let you know that as a 5'3" scout with a short torso, I also have wear my belt on my hips. Lancer standards were not written for short people, it seems.  My belt would look ridiculous on my actual waist, so I scoot it down too. You are in good company. I'm also impressed with all of the tailoring you did for your flight. Nice job getting that down to size. That's a monster job. 

One other thing I wanted to suggest was in curving your armor. Instead of a heat gun, I have heard many people use almost boiling water so it doesn't dry it out. I even used it for a few pieces of my 3D printed armor to get the shoulder bells and other arm parts to wrap better around my arm. Just dip the part you want to bend in quickly and then try to shape. If you need to dip it again, you can, but don't leave it in very long. I did leave one thinner piece in too long, and it definitely rippled and needed a reprint. Oops, happens to all of us  And now that you have an extra piece, you can even practice with it. You may find that you want to curve the shoulder bridges and the parts at the sides where the straps go instead of the middle part. Another smaller scout did that with her SC armor. You can look through her WIP here: 

Reading back, I somehow missed the boiling water method was something you already used, and I’m glad it worked for you! Just ignore me over here  

[Glory530]

I just completed my "real" vest. The fabric is the Classic Sportswear Cotton Twill from Joann's, and I used two layers of low loft batting in the sleeves. Photos are below. I'm still happy with the sleeve edges relative to the shoulder bell edges after making the adjustments to my practice muslin piece. Also, it looks like I forgot to have my husband straighten my armor in the back, because it's a little crooked (oops).

Do the sleeves look too flared at the bottom, or are they OK? It's an easy adjustment to take in the side seams a little to reduce the amount of flare, if needed.

[Chopper]

I would take the side seams in a little bit to reduce the flare, if it's an easy fix for you to do.