SC Helmet Mod - The Noobtastic "Sink or Swim" Thread

[bwattsup]

I've finally started my Scout build with the item that convinced me to become a Scout in the first place:

 

"The Bucket"

 

Over the last couple of months, I've looked at enough pics to go cross-eyed at times. It's been tough deliberating between which lid to purchase, because they each have their own idiosyncrasies. I finally settled on the SC helmet because I think it has the right general shape, and can be modified into something close to screen accurate. The main thing I wanted in my helmet [that’s lacking on an SC] are the “cheeksâ€. Now that I’ve held it in my hands, I can see some other areas that are in need of improvement. I’m sure that I will probably find more along the way as well. As of now, I plan on modify the following:

1. The visor/faceplate mounts on each side of the helmet.
   
2. The chin strap strips on both sides of the helmet.
   
3. The top needs to be flattened.
   
4. The “ear†holes need to be more defined on the inside by adding depth and correct curvature.
   
5. Bring out more definition in the face in general (especially around the “eyesâ€).
   
6. Installing “cheeks†on the faceplate.
   
7. Scratch building a chin cup.
   

This is my first foray into costuming/prop building, and I want to learn something through this experience. So bear with me… I’m either going to succeed at modifying this helmet, or I’m going to fail miserably. And I’m OK with that. Ya gotta learn somehow. Plus, I ordered the “White Parts Only†kit which was considerably cheaper than a full helmet kit.

 

Last Tuesday, my box arrived from SC! (Thanks again Jeff!)

 

 

 

 

It was slated to arrive the day before, but Hurricane Sandy (you know…the nickname for a TD) delayed delivery. Pretty fateful, considering later that day the Disney buyout occurred. It felt amazing to finally be holding something in my hands that I’ve only seen in 2 dimensions for most of my life.

 

 

 

 

I shot a couple of more quick pictures, just to have some reference images for later. Surprisingly, my kit included the nose greeblie and decals. I thought I was going to have to purchase one from DJ, but SC’s nose greeblie looks accurate to me.

 

 

 

I wanted to start slapping the kit together right then, but life (and work) got in the way. It will have to wait until another day for a rough mock up. This is going to be a really slow mod/build folks. Fortunately, I have nothing but time. It’s going to be about 6 months (or more) before my armor arrives from MC

[chimei]

i remember when my KS arrived in pieces. at first i thought, "oh, i should've paid the extra to have it assembled." but once i got into it, it wasn't so bad. good luck with it...

 

also, don't use the screen in the "ears"...paint the inside black instead. screen-used buckets didn't have the mesh screens.

[Donovan]

They wont sell me this kit

[bwattsup]

i remember when my KS arrived in pieces. at first i thought, "oh, i should've paid the extra to have it assembled." but once i got into it, it wasn't so bad. good luck with it...

 

also, don't use the screen in the "ears"...paint the inside black instead. screen-used buckets didn't have the mesh screens.

 

I wouldn't dream of putting the screen in the ears Mark. All of the screen used helmets I've seen have black cloth attached to them. That's the look I'll be going for

 

It was kind of daunting prior to drilling some holes in it. As soon as I made the first hole, Everything was alright!

 

They wont sell me this kit

 

Again, sorry Donovan for misleading you. I hope I didn't make a mess for Jeff by telling you so. Sorry Jeff

[bwattsup]

Alright…I was able to put a little bit of time into my build this week. After another rough mock up, I finally slapped the helmet together. I used the pilot “divots†on the different pieces as my guide. The top was really easy to set in place because of the way Jeff makes his molds. The top and side have a couple of spots that butt together nicely, letting you know exactly how they are supposed to fit. I just taped my top in initially so I could further evaluate the helmet. Overall, if you are looking for an easy helmet to build, the SC is super easy to put together. At least if you plan on keeping it “factory freshâ€.

 

 

Initially, I drilled another hole on the right side to make the face plate/visor sit closer to flush on the back shell. After doing so, I was convinced that the issue was actually shape; not placement. The top back corners of the visor need to be re-cut. I drew some lines and was prepared to cut the hinge corners, but thankfully…I stopped. It needs to wait until I’m just focusing on the front.

 

I need to keep reminding myself during this mod to take my time, and really think things through. That could have been a big mistake that would have taken a lot to overcome. I made one of those mistakes a little later in my build.

 

 

I snapped a couple of pics of the “ear†holes so I could compare them to the screen used helmets. They have the right general shape on the outside. Only a portion of the inner hole needs to be reworked. I ordered some Apoxie Sculpt this week so I can reshape the inner “earsâ€. Should have it really soon. It’s another one of those things that I’ve only read about. I can’t wait to play around with some.

 

 

I’m going to be using the Apoxie Sculpt on the top of my Helmet as well. Screen accurate helmets have a flattened top. The SC helmet has a rounded shape. This was my first “Oh s***!†moment of the project. It was kind of scary to tell you the truth.

 

I grabbed a baking pan from the kitchen, and placed it on a table. I heated up the top piece with a heat gun on low, trying to disperse temperature evenly. As soon as if I saw the plastic turn wavy, I pushed it down on the baking pan. It worked, but not as perfectly as I had imagined. The Apoxie Sculpt (and some serious sanding) will take care of the rest.

 

 

 

When I got the helmet, it had a couple of “forming ripples†in the ABS. I attempted using a sealing iron on them to flatten them out. It’s apparently a skill that I’m lacking (lol), and will need to learn on something non-critical. Mad props to Pandatrooper for making it look so easy! Trust me, it’s not.

 

 

It was at this point that I decided to cut away the bottom portion of the front shell (where the chin strap elastic attaches). The overhang on the front of the shell wasn’t wide enough to accommodate the proper chin cup elastic. From the pictures in the gallery, I determined the elastic is supposed to be 1†wide. The mount plate for it is at least 1.5†wide. I eyeballed the cut location and made a mark. I then took a measurement from the top of the “ear†so I could make a line on the other side. Initially, I planned on just gluing some sheet styrene in place of the ABS. I made the cuts on both sides. Little did I know: I was making my first mistake.

 

 

I was happy with the cut line, and even shaved a little more off with a Dremel. It wasn’t until I reattached the visor/faceplate that I realized how I erred. By cutting away those strips, I had just lost the support structure for the bottom front of the shell. It wanted to start following its natural curve now. The middle part (ear section) of the shell expanded out, making it difficult to close the face plate fully. The lower section of the shell curved inwards on both sides. I even tried to use some washers behind the mounting screws, but that didn’t help either.

 

Flush, it sits not.

 

 

 

I’ve learned a valuable lesson this week. When you think you have things thought out logically, write it all on paper and play your own devils’ advocate. Back to the drawing board I guess. I’ve got some ideas of what to do now that are even better than my initial thoughts. Overall, I’m glad I made this mistake. It’s caused me to really look at all aspects of the screen helmet. I think what I have in mind now will make it even better in the end. I was going to skimp on the details of the helmets inside; focusing solely on the outside appearance. Now, I’m going to try to make it look accurate all around.

[bwattsup]

Since I’m going to tackle the “ears†as the next portion of my project, I made some collage shots. I wanted to eliminate flip flopping between a bunch of reference pictures when I start modifying. All pictures were sourced from the BSN Gallery, StarWarsHelmets.com, the LFL/EFX mold, and the Prop Store. These will be a good reference for anyone else looking to scratch build/modify a helmet.

 

I noticed for the first time last night, that the right and left ear cutouts are 2 different shapes. The left ear has the traditional "bean" shape that we cut into our helmets. The right ear actually has the same shape; except for the top inside corner. That corner is not rounded on the right ear. Instead, it meets in a 90 degree corner. I would assume it’s a defect from the vacuum pull on these helmets. I just thought it was an interesting thing to point out.

 

Alright, here’s more “ear†pics than most people will ever want to look at.

 

Inside Portion/Mold

 

 

Inside Helmet View

 

 

Right Ear

 

 

Left Ear

 

[bwattsup]

It’s been a while since I’ve had a chance to post. In short: My build is back on…and in full swing again.

I received my Apoxie Sculpt in the mail, and finalized my strategy for restoring strength to the front portion of the helmet. If you have never used this material, I highly recommend it. It bonds really well to ABS plastic.

 

 

Figuring it would promote better adhesion, I pre-sanded the areas where I wanted to apply Apoxie Sculpt. I broke out some wax paper, and equal portions of the A & B materials. After twisting the strands together, I kneaded the combination for about 5 minutes. It’s pretty sticky for about the first 15 minutes, and very easy to work with for at least 2 hours. (Note: Use gloves with this product. It can cause skin rashes.)

 

 

Since this was my first time using it, I applied the material pretty liberally to both sides of the helmet. I started with thick strips around the ears, and then moved to the front of the helmet. It was probably too thick, but I wasn’t sure how much I was going to need.

 

 

Before I used the Apoxie Sculpt, I took some width measurements with the faceplate attached. I used these measurements to spread the lower front, and clamp the center into proper position. The top was also clamped on to keep everything in proportion. I left this jig in place for 24 hours as the Apoxie Sculpt cured. After release, I found a spot where I had apparently stuck my finger in it. Whoops!!

The helmet is now pretty solid again. It of course added some weight to the shell, but not as much as I had expected. Most importantly, the front no longer wants to curl inwards.

 

 

Now for the fun part……Ahhhhhhh……Sanding. There is just something therapeutic about sanding.

I turned on some music and sanded away for hours. Every once in a while, my daughter stopped by and asked me questions. She wanted to know about the different types of tools. She also said, “Why are you doing all of this for just a helmet?†My answer: “Some things just have to be done right.†When she asked me what she could do to help, I told to take some photos. The R2 on the desk was her gift for inspiration.

 

 

 

I’m going to try and post some more tonight. I have “ears†to show ya!

 

…to be continued

[Southscout]

Interesting! It will be nice to see the end product.

 

Love the R2 on the desk, when I made my armor I was sometimes meaner than a rattlesnake... Had to make it up afterwards by letting the kids run around with the helmet on.

[bwattsup]

Interesting! It will be nice to see the end product. Love the R2 on the desk, when I made my armor I was sometimes meaner than a rattlesnake... Had to make it up afterwards by letting the kids run around with the helmet on.

That's funny Patrik. So far it's been great sharing this experience with my daughter. I even have this made up song I torment her with. lol The words are: "Scout Trooper...Go Scout Trooper". It's just something silly I do with her.

[bwattsup]

Here are the results of my sanding. The ears aren’t completely finished yet. They just need some filler, extra sanding, and a bit more TLC. I’m trying to get all the inside work done before I put the top on. I also still have to decide what level of accuracy I’m going for. It’s never going to be perfect, but hopefully close.

 

These pictures were taken right after I filed the basic shape.

 

 

 

Here, I rounded the edge corners. I also made the depth line on the wall of the helmet a little more pronounced. That way it looks like it’s floating away from the side wall.

 

 

Left and right ears roughly finished. I’m going to go back and fill the white areas with Apoxie Sculpt.

 

 

 

The part everyone will actually see….The outside. I’m still not sure if I want to add the 90 degree edge at the top of the right ear. This would match the prop store helmet. Maybe…we’ll see. The extra cut on the right side was caused by a Dremel. I pushed in a little too hard and caught the edge with the spindle. :/ From that point on, I hand filed and sanded.

 

 

The side views look off in the photos. I guess it has something to do with how close I’m holding the camera. A two dimensional optical illusion if you will. The inside lines actually extend further back. When I eyeball it, you can only see the center section of that line. That’s the way the prop store helmet side view is.

 

 

Once I finished the ears, I started to work on the structure strips. I drew a line at 5mm, and then removed the rest. Theses strips stiffened the helmet. They are also going to serve as a base for attaching the front chin strap strips. I think I’m going to do a little more work in this area. I have symmetry issues that need to be fixed.

 

 

 

Well that’s it for now. I’ve done a little more on the helmet, but I’ll share that another day.

[pleasum]

This is excellent! I'm really enjoying the build. Can't wait to see the finished product. Great tip on the epoxy material too. I'm sure that will come in handy.

 

Thanks Barry.

[bwattsup]

Glad you're enjoying it Paul. It's been really satisfying thus far. Just wish I had more time to work on it.

[Donovan]

Dang looking bad ass Barry cant wait for your finished results (oh ive decided MC for the armor)

[bwattsup]

Dang looking bad ass Barry cant wait for your finished results (oh ive decided MC for the armor)

 

Thanks bro. I can't wait either Hopefully it all continues to go well. Lots of work to do on it.

 

That's awesome on the MC. I went that route as well. You can probably just pick yours up and save on shipping. Nice fringe benefit ya got there. Did you decide what lid you are going to get yet?

[Donovan]

Kathy sed i can pick it up to save on shipping and i want sc but i dont have 370 or 215 for a helmet lol

[Donovan]

Also without modding this helmet is it a fairly easy build?

[bwattsup]

Kathy sed i can pick it up to save on shipping and i want sc but i dont have 370 or 215 for a helmet lol

 

I understand totally where your coming from bro, but the SC kit is worth it. I like it as is. Just want it to be even better.

 

Also without modding this helmet is it a fairly easy build?

 

It's real easy to build normally. There are dimples in the plastic to show you where the screw holes need to be drilled. The top kinda interlocks into place too. The only thing I'd recommend, is to ask Jeff to leave a little "meat on the bones" when he trims each piece. My front wasn't wide enough to accomodate the chin strap elastic needed for lancer status. Plus, the faceplate benefits from a little extra plastic on the bottom.

[Donovan]

_{lol im going to try to get a white kit out of jeff lol it probably wont work.}

[bwattsup]

After I constructed the ears, and gained a little confidence on this project, I decided to go for the infamous "double vent" of the prop store helmet. I looked at the gallery pics and then roughly drew out the shape I thought would match it. Once I scuffed out the shape on the back, I then drilled pilot holes to let me know where I needed to apply Apoxie Sculpt on the inside.

 

 

One area where an SC lid benefits from softer pulls is the vent section. I just think the single vents need to be a little deeper and more pronounced. This unassembled/unpainted helmet gives some of the best views of what the helmet is supposed to look like. It's really difficult at times deciphering the 2D to 3D code.

 

 

After looking at the reference pics, I decided to make modifications to the single vents, and the traps. I applied the material to those areas, and then also applied a block around the backs of the visor guides (I'll explain that part later).What I've learned lately is that I need to take more time actually sculpting with Apoxie Sculpt. It will save me a ton of time in the sanding department.

 

 

I reclaimed a table in my house, and set up my drying/shell shape jig. The material on the back also affects the shape and flexibility of the shell. I figured it was best to err on the side of caution.

 

Unfortunately, my jig interrupted "The Battle of the Krusty Krab". Apparently Mandalorians and Clones on Speeder Bikes "can't resist a Krabby Patty". lol

 

 

Before I started the double vent, I sanded down the single vent to the right of it's location. These pics show my initial vent depth. I sanded them even deeper later.

 

 

Here's the pictures of both the single and double vents. These are not final. Just pictures during different stages of the process.

 

 

OK...So that Apoxie Sculpt I put on the back of the visor guides was put there for a couple of reasons. The first being support, and the second for sanding. The left and the right side have symmetry issues due to a much softer pull on the left side of the helmet. On a normal SC build, this wouldn't be an issue. On mine, it is. I plan to make return edges on the back of my visor and want all of the clearance space possible. The original helmets have a visor "latch" in place here. I decided it was best to remove the material and start with a fresh surface. I couldn't do the whole job at once, because I still need the upper strips for a clamping surface. They will help for attaching the top.Eventually, this whole area will be recessed flat. Right now, it's just the centers that are flat/flush. On the right side, I may have to add Apoxie Sculpt on the outside. On the left side, the material will be added to the inside. I also found something else out in this process. When you sand Apoxie Sculpt very thinly, it starts losing adhesion to the ABS. Not sure if this came from rotary tool vibration or how the ABS is already stressed from trying to curve. It's really not a big deal here though. All of the front ABS material will eventually be cut away.

 

 

 

I also worked on the traps. What little bit of sanding I did to them, showed me I didn't need the amount of Apoxie Sculpt I applied to the back. Oh well, lesson learned. It never hurts to have more support though.

 

I sanded the flat area of the trapezoid until the edges weren't as rolled. I then sanded the top and side edges flat.with a little bit of a soft exit. This change is really subtle. But it's one I had to make after looking at reference shots. I'm still not convinced I'm right on these changes. We'll see after I put some primer on them.

 

 

Here's how the back looks now. I've got a couple of things to fix. I sanded through the ABS on a couple of the vents. I'm going to build these areas back up over the next couple of days. Plus I'm going to fill some of the areas to finish off my "ears". Once these are done, I'm going to apply some primer around the vents and traps. It's the only way I'm going to be able to see what I've actually got.

 

 

 

I've looked at the back of this helmet for far too long now. It's starting to turn into the Michelin Man!!! His "eyes" are beginning to freak me out. lol

 

Anyone else ever notice this? Was this the inspiration?

 

[Chef]

excellent job there Barry.

 

shaping up to be a mighty fine lid.

[bwattsup]

excellent job there Barry.

 

shaping up to be a mighty fine lid.

 

Thanks Rob! I'm kind of winging it as I go along. I hope it turns out nice in the end.

[bwattsup]

I’m taking a break from the sculpting/sanding department. I need to start learning how to heat, bend and join ABS plastic to my helmet. Originally, I was going to use styrene. After heating and bending a piece. I quickly decided against it. Regular styrene is far too brittle when stressed.

 

I acquired a half sheet (4’x 4’) of 1/16^th ABS from my local plastics dealer for $16. The material is single-sided haircell texture. This is actually the type of ABS used on the prop store helmet (with the haircell pattern on the inside). When they told me they only had black in stock, it didn’t concern me a bit. The whole helmet is going to be repainted. After cutting a portion off, I laid out a quick drawing. I traced a quarter for the rounded tip of the chin strap support.

 

 

 

As I got ready to attempt my first bend, my daughter tells me “There’s a leak in the bathroom dad.â€

When I got there I see water spurting out from the trap of my sink. Immediately, I said “Bring me that sculpting stuff I’ve been working with…and a bucket!†During my research phase, I remembered reading that the stuff would cure underwater. I let her knead enough for a patch, and then applied it across the base. Problem solved!!!! Lol

 

I laughed about it for a while, because: A) this was the first thing I thought of using, and that as much as I needed a break from it, here it was saving me in a time of need. Glad I had it around. I’m starting to feel like the company spokesman for this stuff.

 

 

Alright, back to work. I made the first bend by hand without applying heat. After seeing it stretch, I knew this would never fly. I played around with my sealing iron until I found a temp setting that allowed me to bend the plastic. Here’s the first bends. Thanks to Terry (Pandatrooper) for making those videos. I’ve watched them a couple of times now. Great tutorial!

 

 

I applied too much heat on my bottom return edge. It spilled over onto an area that was reserved for the corner bends. After cutting some strips, I used the sealing iron to make the bends. I’m going to make my cuts narrower next time. Not bad for a first attempt though. The corners will be cemented together and filled. I think I’m going to make some ABS paste out of sprue and acetone.

 

 

These pictures illustrate what I’m trying to accomplish.

 

 

 

I clamped the piece on, and started playing around with it. I’m still trying to figure this out as I go along.

 

 

 

I marked and cut out some of the excess material in the center. When I remake this piece, I’m going to leave some extra material on the bottom edge. I think it will be stronger overall by cementing this tab to the side wall. On the center, I’m going to make a bend and glue it to the Apoxie Sculpt. The top edge will be cemented to the upper band/visor mount. Like I said…I’m winging it. I do have a vision, just not sure how’s all going to come together yet.

 

 

The gallery pics show the correct bend to be almost as close to the diagonals of the ears. In order to make this bend, I threw a scrap piece of 1/16^th in between the piece and the front edge. I’ve got to either build up the side, or cut away some Apoxie Sculpt. Whatever I do, I have to ensure the helmet is still going to fit, and the faceplate is going to close. It’s already getting tight. I have to wear a balaclava to prevent my ears from being clipped by the bottom.

 

 

 

This piece isn’t going to be the one I actually use. I’m going to try some other bending methods first.

[bwattsup]

Next up…the paint stick and vise method. I really like this one, because you are able to bend really straight lines without warping the plastic. I think the sealing iron is advantageous for certain bends, but this method is easier to work with. I taped a couple of 1/16^th ABS scraps between the ends of 2 paint sticks. The sticks easily slide around a sheet, and serve 2 purposes. The first is to protect the areas that you don’t want heated. The second is to give you a base/handle/edge for making bends.

 

During this project, I’ve been extremely fortunate to have a Harbor Freight store close by. Nearly every tool I’ve used has been from Harbor Freight. Now some things I wouldn’t buy from them, but most tools work just as well as expensive brand names. The heat gun and nozzle accessories cost me less than $20 total. The articulated vise was $15, and is great for working with small/lightweight pieces.

 

The first piece I bent with this method was for the front brow strip. I spaced the paint sticks slightly apart and focused my heat on the tiny strip of exposed plastic between the sticks. Once it was evenly heated, I made the bend until I reached approximately 90 degrees.

 

 

I marked off a half inch, and cut the remaining material away. I then made marks a ½â€™ apart down the length of the piece. Using my scissors, I cut notches while bending to the desired shape. After completing the bend, I cut out a strip that matched the shape and glued it to the bottom. It didn’t retain the exact arc I wanted after gluing. I eventually glued another strip to the top side. It’s now pretty close to the shape I want. The bend is pretty stressed though. Hopefully it will end up working. If not, I’ll just try something else.

 

 

 

I remade the chin strap strips using the paint stick bend method. Much crisper lines overall. In the corners, I cut thinner strips. Before bending the corners, I clamped a quarter on to help me keep the curved bend uniform.

 

 

 

I made a couple of rectangular pieces for the areas above the chin strap strips. I kept the measurements really vague in order to have some material to play around with. This project is kind of like a jig saw. I’m still trying to figure out how to mount all of these pieces. It’s a good thing that I like puzzles!

 

The next three collage shots give you a general idea of the process. I kept making changes, and cutting excess material out along the way.

 

 

 

 

These are the pieces as of now. The bends on the long strip of the lower sections serve to kick the strap strips out to the necessary angle. I was having a hard time closing the faceplate, until I made this modification. I’m probably going to remake these pieces again. It’s a learning process…but one that I’m really enjoying!

 

[bwattsup]

I need some advice on primer painting my helmet. What kind of paint should I be looking for? Do high build primers conceal scratches more? Do I need to sand out every scratch? Painting is not my forte. That's one aspect I haven't really looked into yet. I'm not ready to paint the whole helmet, but I am ready to see what still needs to be worked on.

[ukscout]

hi

 

love the progress pics and how you've constructed the helmet so far.

 

painting - prep the surfaces with wet n dry paper to get out all the major scratches and also this

will provide a key for the undercoat to be applied too.

 

Also ensure the helmet is de-greased before painting.

 

I've seen other guys that paint TK helmets stand the paint can in boiling water to help the paint be more

fulid....but I've not tried this before.

 

I've always used a grey primer first then a white primer one I've identified areas that need to be given more sanding time

too as if will highlight alot of issues.

 

then wet n dry each spray layer once dry

 

keep repeating the process until happy before laying down the final white layer

 

always apply in thin coats as the paint will run if over painted

 

also leave each layer of paint to dry before applying another layer

 

From the photo's I've seen of your SC helmet, the overall final pull of the plastic seems very soft

and badly warpped in areas?